Note to Nyles

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3Hugger
Community Member
Posts: 242

Note to Nyles

Post#1 » Thu 16 May, 2019 11:04 am

Reaction to Nyles
Nyles wrote:We clearly communicated this to you as you joined: The whole thing depends on GiPPO's time how much he can commit.

EUTW has been in maintenance mode for the last 1 1/2 years, focusing on keeping the servers up and running and doing necessary work around that while donations are coming in.

We know that this is frustrating, but it shouldn't come as a surprise.

You were told explicitly what you can expect and that there won't be much support. We took a chance with involving you and giving you a chance to update layouts and introduce new ones. As you can see, it has also created tension with other people in the community - especially when you start bumping heads with your patronizing knows-it-all attitude.

I wish you the best of luck, finding the mod team community you are searching for, but threads like this are a bit pathetic to be honest and are quite revealing about your personality.


And this is exactly what the problem is: EUTW's default reaction to any critics is to lock them up. And if they don't silence they disappear. I chose to fight a battle I found worth fighting. I was fighting for EUTW, for progress, for growth, for community input and an open development, but EUTW rather fights against this.

Silencing critics is not what you achieved though, you silenced (once again) the community, by taking away their chance to react. I wrote, someone else reacted, you wrote and then you lock it up: taking away the chance of the community to communicate. All you do is dilute to maintain your narrative, and like Deathiceal in the other thread: it is okay for people to have a different perspective and read they way they want to read and interpret as they do; that is the beauty of it: we do not have to agree to work together and move forward.

But EUTW is:
- promising a better future (just read past messages and information as shared by EUTW);
- takes people money and time (the community pays the donation tax & pays in information in return of a promise, but is being kept blind on the outside);
- then severely limits their means of communication (EUTW is controlling the narrative, by silencing critics);
- then locks critics up (serious threads with critical information is being locked and has been many times);
- too critical people disappear for a time (plenty of bans on personal grounds, based on critics);
- Some consistent people have disappeared permanent.....

A last note though: EUTW did not do any community layouts anymore until Vicious and I started to work on them again.
Where Vicious does the right thing when he no longer could prioritize EUTW, he leaves it open for others to pick up the slack, he same can't be said of some others.

Nyles (and GIPPO) : Once can reconsider this policy of locking up critics and blaming the player, it doesn't need to be this severely limited experience bound to this very small 'group' holding all the power and freedoms.

Understand you can impose your will only because of the situation you are in, but a community can choose.
As did I, I chose to stop to step up and try to build from the inside, as I do not agree and have serious ethical concerns for the EUTW policies and practices in place.

If you allow others in, instead of the current equivalent of vendor lock-in ('donate else we exceed to exist and no, you may only be happy the way things are, as we are awesome and pride ourselves daily for how good we are for those undeserving people and trolls of the community, we sacrifice so much for you we can not afford anything else' - attitude.)

Yes I see an other lock in the future, I see a delete, I see a ban, I see more complaints, I see .... positive potential as well!
Can you turn for the better, see where all the critics come from and apply this to yourself? I understand why you react to me the way you do, I can even predict how you react, do you understand how others perceive you too?

There is always an opportunity to go for the best possible outcome,... always.

For me this is at this moment not fighting from the inside, hidden behind the iron wall, but to present this means of communication publicly, out in the open, so you can choose to lock, remove or ban, or to leave communication open, for the community to jump in share, let thém tell us how it is!.

Nyles wrote:...threads like this are a bit pathetic to be honest and are quite revealing about your personality.

Yes please be honest, you may hurt some feelings here and there, but honesty is usually the preferred way of communication!

(post scriptum: this could have been 1 thread if threads did not get locked, which keeps communication in place, easier to keep oversight!)

3Hugger
Community Member
Posts: 242

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#2 » Thu 16 May, 2019 11:09 am

Oh yeah, do you remember the past? EUTW wasn't always like this, it has become like this under current management.

TheMasterofBlubb
PVP Warfare Admin
Posts: 392

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#3 » Thu 16 May, 2019 12:57 pm

Can you specify what you mean by this?
"donate else we exceed to exist"

User avatar
scratch
Community Member
Posts: 968

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#4 » Thu 16 May, 2019 5:15 pm

much respect to people who able speak their mind
the floor is lava!

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Deeelite
Donator
Posts: 679

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#5 » Thu 16 May, 2019 7:52 pm

EUTW is a powerful way to use ArmAs potentials
TeeTime team had a brilliant idea and EUTW picked up their abandoned project giving it 6 years of life more.
Tons of modifications and improvements have been slowly added with time. Any tweak has been both criticized and welcome at the same time by us players since the very start. I'm here since when this pvp was called 'TeeTime' directly watching and personally living the whole evolution of all this stuff. I never claimed for any right because I always tried to understand admins/scripters points of wiew at first place. I want to belive that EUTW's staff always tried to put together all the coexsisting pros and cons before any released update. This last one includes both in between admins and in between players huge divergences, all combined to feasibility, in terms of scripting.
I'd like to mention one big example here: EUTW finally released a fantastic eden editor tool in order to let the community create their own layouts. Once they done it, they have been somehow forced to check tons of layouts, some of them good and some quite horrible, and then put them in rotation. The result I initially assisted to was a continuos complaining by majority of the players. Who are we supposed to put the blame on here, dudes? I know admins are aware about EUTW engine is still far for beiing at its peak and they admitted it, as well as they told us they are sorry for being absent, lately. I know they are also aware they lost many admins and scripters due to different causes but I still behave here like I was in somebody else's home, not claiming for any right. So, since I don't know how many times Nyles and Gippo have spent how many hours in their whole life, trying to give us an 'hopefully valuable-product' which always have been toughly criticized by us, I don't feel myself in the position to make any accusation. They already know what I don't like 'coz I already posted it. I will keep on cursing on each critical hit and while I'm driving MHQ trucks up the Melden hills but that's my way to deal with eutw pvp.
What I can surely state is that EUTW's quality still depends a lot on players quality.

I'm of course sad on each time I see this community getting more and more divided or unpopulated.

I too see there are some urgent modification or little tweaks to be implemented before it is too late, but I don't feel logic to push the trailer before the horses.

@ 3hugger: you did a great job sticking to your best intentions so far, but forgetting you would find youself alone speeding up your steps.
Thank you anyway, I totally understand your point of view hoping that you will understand mine as well.

@admins: automatic in-game messages are still asking players to give you feedback, suggestions and donations so, things that 3Hugger pointed-up should be considered, anyway. I only suggest you to give the community more feedback as well, in terms of things you are willing to do and not, specifying the supposed lenght of time required.
Consider that lots of player have gone due the fact that there are really few things at least that should be arranged. It's not my case but I partially understand them. This is a problem. A date on Discord where we can talk together, you admins with part of us veteran and reg. players, would be a great chance to clarify lot of things forum cannot.

@ all the players: the more you quit EUTW the worse we will play :bangin: :D

Deee
"When taking part in a discussion, the most difficult thing is not defending your opinion, but knowing what it is in the first place." André Maurois

User avatar
GiPPO
EUTW Management
Posts: 7135

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#6 » Thu 16 May, 2019 8:58 pm

Sorry man, I have just pointed out that your post was a little harsh and I asked you to kind of defuse it - because it would've been weird if I did that, but I needed to do it anyways.

Then you announced your resignation then posted a "The EUTW used force to kick me out! " titled post with a "no not really" in the text which is ultimate "fuck you" move from you. We are not silencing critics, we are trying to avoid the harmful posts, ESPECIALLY IF IT IS COMING FROM AN EUTW MEMBER. You worked hard - probably the most out of all, I appreciate that, but you do not understand that - even if you are angry and I can totally understand you - you cannot just create a post like that like you were a regular community member. I turned to you, I let you know - you couldn't understand and quit and started angry posting. I am sorry it didn't work out. This is a reason why we are not recruiting anyone who wants to join.
I did not want it to blow it up like that and I haven't ever imagined that you will blow this up.

"donate else we exceed to exist " - this is true, like it or not. We have been running the servers with the money donated by the community.
"If It Isn't Documented, It Doesn't Exist"

User avatar
Nyles
EUTW Management
Posts: 3370

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#7 » Fri 17 May, 2019 9:53 am

My only other two cents here is to kindly ask you to piss off 3Hugger. Bye!

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GiPPO
EUTW Management
Posts: 7135

Re: Note to Nyles

Post#8 » Fri 17 May, 2019 11:46 am

Also donation is not a tax. It is literally the cost of the server. Just to clear things up. Now and then people come here and slightly suggest that we steal money or at least make money on the donations. This is not true and very stupid to assume (especially from a former eutw member). I can export you the transaction history if needed. If something, I actually put additional money in for the email service. Also all of us who could but very high chunk got paid by the bad and evil Nyles has paid the missing server costs when Trnapster decided to fuck is over by not fixing the donation PayPal account he was the main owner of, basically fucking us over with 700 Euros of the Donator's money. So yeah this is how we take all of your money.
"If It Isn't Documented, It Doesn't Exist"

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