[new layout Altis] Reach

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RagedLemon
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[new layout Altis] Reach

Post#1 » Sat 19 Nov, 2016 6:27 am

Layout:Reach
Author: RagedLemon
Faction 1: blufor
Faction 2: opfor
Description:

Download: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/611ph2j0nexr ... 1rO_a?dl=0

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Airfield:
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Last edited by RagedLemon on Thu 13 Apr, 2017 6:58 am, edited 2 times in total.

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#2 » Sat 19 Nov, 2016 11:22 am

Nice but few too many connections. Maybe removing popolia to planes and the equivalent
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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Nyles
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#3 » Sat 19 Nov, 2016 1:26 pm

Avoid using the SE airfield. It is all but impossible to take-off and land their with some planes. Preferably move the airfield for the northern team to the far NE airstrip and move the one of the southern team to the salt lake.

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#4 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 1:56 am

Nyles wrote:Avoid using the SE airfield. It is all but impossible to take-off and land their with some planes. Preferably move the airfield for the northern team to the far NE airstrip and move the one of the southern team to the salt lake.


Will do! :bigthumb:

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#5 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 1:57 am

@War wrote:Nice but few too many connections. Maybe removing popolia to planes and the equivalent


I agree, just changed the layout please give feed back on the change if you can.

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#6 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 10:30 am

I like it. Interesting size of the choke split 3 flags.

It would be worth thinking if rock slide/refugee flags are actually required or if they would just extend that end of game phase unnecessarily? An alt to removing them (if you really want them in) would be to move the military/ambush connection to rock slide (and same for other side)

!but to be hon st that's just not picking it's fine as is anyway.

Good work interested to see how it plays
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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Hazardous Mouse
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#7 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 11:28 am

I like how @War in every topic talk about "too many connections" haha
Lot of connections good for opfor ^^ cuz when lot of connections then blu4 dont defend ^^ lol
Blu4 simply cant understand where should they go to defend cuz many connections ^^ and opfor attack multiple flags at the same time. And opfor rekt blu4 in 40 mins round.

I dont care many connections or not many. For me its intresting to play both. I like diversity of layouts.
But i know u like blu4 :) So u prolly trying to make blu4 life better making advaces in every topic "too many connections"
But blu4 sometimes forget defend even when flags in one line ^^ Perfect example Antrakia layout and Biolab - Antrakia - Charkia line ^^ Even there blu4 sometime forget to defend ^^ Its just insane level of incompetence.

So part of me understand you :) and part of me agree with you about "too many connections" thing

Good looking layout RagedLemon. I think all fine with connections. 11 flags and 14 connections.
My layout lakka with 10 flags and 12 connections. Very close numbers. I see nothing wrong with both layouts.
Keep doing man. Sometimes u doing weird things :) and sometimes rly good looking things :)
Anyways weird layout or good looking layout :) It will be intresting to test all of them.
Q: How many liberals can figure out what 2+2= ? A: Zero, they just protest that it can be whatever it wants to be.

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#8 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 11:53 am

I hadn't realised it but yeah your probably right that less connections is easier fo blu.

However that's not why I said that. I don't want an easier life for blufor. And yeah I think the "incompetency" would be there anyway.

if you read the thread properly;

1. His initial layout wasn't 11 flag to 14 connections it was more hence why I advised few too many.
2. My last post wasn't about less connections rather about the final stand flag being a bit redundant.
3. I finish my last post saying that's just me nit picking and it's probably fine as is.

However I generally do believe that layouts with a spider web effect of connections ruin the gameplay. I'm sure if we all had your level of skill it would be different but for us mere humans (the majority) it is nice to be able to enjoy our time with layouts that focus the match a bit at times and do allow for the average (or as u put it "incompetent") player/team to still stand a chance.
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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Hazardous Mouse
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#9 » Sun 20 Nov, 2016 12:18 pm

@War wrote:I hadn't realised it but yeah your probably right that less connections is easier fo blu.

Yeah that why i think less connections good thing. More chance to have balanced round that dont end just after 40 mins.

@War wrote:However that's not why I said that. I don't want an easier life for blufor.

Then i with my assumption just wrong.

@War wrote:And yeah I think the "incompetency" would be there anyway.

Agree

@War wrote:if you read the thread properly;
1. His initial layout wasn't 11 flag to 14 connections it was more hence why I advised few too many.

I cant read it properly cuz he prolly delete screnshoot of map of first verison. Yeah i see there his first post was Edited one time. So i cant see whole picture ^^ even if i try my best.

@War wrote:2. My last post wasn't about less connections rather about the final stand flag being a bit redundant.

I commented not this last ur post.
I commented not just this ur first post in this thread "Nice but few too many connections. Maybe removing popolia to planes and the equivalent"

I commented all ur posts where u talk about "too much connections" in lot of threads in this subforum.

@War wrote:3. I finish my last post saying that's just me nit picking and it's probably fine as is.

I commented not ur last post. I commented ur tendency to give advice "too many connections" in many topics.

@War wrote:However I generally do believe that layouts with a spider web effect of connections ruin the gameplay.

I agree on this 100%. Game going in circles. Opfor capture flag A at this time lu4 capture flag D. Then opfor move from A to B and blu4 move from D to E. Then opfor move from B to C and blu4 move from E to A.
Opfor from C to D. Blu4 from A to B.
Opfor from D to E. Blu4 from B to C
Opfor from E to A. Blu4 from C to D

Or something like that ^^ depend of spider web connections structure.

Yeah here i agree with you 100%. Spider web effect can ruin gameplay.

Its was just misunderstanding that i look at map screnshoot where i see 11 flags and 14 connections and no any Spider web. And then i see your post where u again give advice "too many connections" :)
Q: How many liberals can figure out what 2+2= ? A: Zero, they just protest that it can be whatever it wants to be.

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#10 » Thu 15 Dec, 2016 4:03 am

UPDATED DOWNLOAD 12/14/2016, Note: Changed Position of Airfield to upper Molos due to one of the Airfields being at the NW Airfield.

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#11 » Sun 18 Dec, 2016 3:28 pm

good layout but maybe rocky side and refugee are not needed? Just a though.
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#12 » Mon 19 Dec, 2016 4:07 am


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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#13 » Tue 20 Dec, 2016 1:38 am

Cancel my last comment; layout was good as it is.

But then again I didn't play the whole 24 hrs lol.

Had some epic gameplay here. I gotta start recording my arty spotting action... at one point I was handling 3 assets by laser and spotting (Janger in a CAS jet, N3RO in scorcher and Rob with a CAS drone) plus manning my own titan AT and Rob with AA. PLUS providing LMG support on flags with a nightstalker! One of the most technical rounds I've played so far
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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GanzinoDaSigna
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#14 » Tue 20 Dec, 2016 4:21 pm

@War wrote:Cancel my last comment; layout was good as it is.

But then again I didn't play the whole 24 hrs lol.

Had some epic gameplay here. I gotta start recording my arty spotting action... at one point I was handling 3 assets by laser and spotting (Janger in a CAS jet, N3RO in scorcher and Rob with a CAS drone) plus manning my own titan AT and Rob with AA. PLUS providing LMG support on flags with a nightstalker! One of the most technical rounds I've played so far



That was the Match-to-be.
Long period passed without I had possibility to play EUTW; it's great to be back and find it better and better!
Chance favors the prepared mind

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Nyles
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#15 » Wed 21 Dec, 2016 9:58 pm

Couple of the flags are a bit open. Could use some more cover to advance.

Finding good spots for MHQs was hard on the last sectors to the east.

Also that NW airfield needs to change. You can't land to resupply. Instead use the any of the other strips except the one in the far south-east, which is also bad.

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#16 » Wed 21 Dec, 2016 10:31 pm

Nyles wrote:Couple of the flags are a bit open. Could use some more cover to advance.

Finding good spots for MHQs was hard on the last sectors to the east.

Also that NW airfield needs to change. You can't land to resupply. Instead use the any of the other strips except the one in the far south-east, which is also bad.


Thanks, I will update it as soon as possible. :D

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#17 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 12:59 am

UPDATED 12/21/2016
Download: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/611ph2j0nexr ... 1rO_a?dl=0

Updated Eastern Flags and moved Airfield to Molos Airfield.

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Hazardous Mouse
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#18 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 10:07 am

NE combo of flags hard to attack. Plains, Remains and Orino.
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Lets say we SW team and we capture Topolia.
Then we have to capture these 3 flags that close to ebase. Way from our base to these flags just too far if compare with way from ebase to these flags. But its ok while we can defend Topolia all just fine.
So if u deploy mhq close to these flags and start attack then this attack have good chances to fail cuz ebase rly close. And if we lose mhq then we cant even bring more ppl in truck. Closest our flag like 2.5+ km so no time for truck to come in time.
You need give something for attackers. Maybe just simplify links structure a bit.

Now its just "how to hold Topolia 24/7" layout.
imo maybe 2 flags which close to base Orino and Remains can be dead ends. This may help to attackers.
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Paint skills fkn top^^

If u capture Plains then u can capture Orino and Orino will be locked.
If u capture Refugee Houses then u can go to Remains to capture and lock it.



Imo when some flags rly close to base then these flags should be connected by simple connections structure. So that way attackers have good chances vs defenders. When defenders can support these flags with mhqs rly fast then u need give something to attackers.

Yesterday i played this layout and i got rly bored.
First 30-40 mins we capture central flag Reach and capture enemy flag Topolia.
End was rly fast about 45 mins or less maybe we capture all 4 enemy flags.
And all other time like 2-2.5 hours we just defend Topolia cuz we cant do anything else.

I see u like simple connections at center of layouts. And more complicated closer to bases. All this make rounds last longer when attackers cant do shit. I like long rounds when there actualy some progress. But when for hours u just fuck around one flag then no ty.

And these 2 flags Plains and Remains not just hard to attack ^^ cuz all this above but they also so fkn open.
Its like u just hate attackers and do everything to make their lifes harder :)

Was fun to fight though :) But i dont want play it again.

Just look Edessa Bay layout have similar combo of flags which close to ebase :) 4 flags Solar Forest Wrech and Bay. But on this layout this style just fine cuz u can simply buy truck at East Edessa and attack. So all fine. This layout plays much better.
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And on reach layout truck just useless cuz so long way. U just cant be in time to reinforce attack with ur shitty truck ^^
At the same time defenders can reinforce these flags so ez.
Q: How many liberals can figure out what 2+2= ? A: Zero, they just protest that it can be whatever it wants to be.

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#19 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 6:27 pm

Hazardous Mouse wrote:NE combo of flags hard to attack. Plains, Remains and Orino.
Image
Paint skills fkn top^^

If u capture Plains then u can capture Orino and Orino will be locked.
If u capture Refugee Houses then u can go to Remains to capture and lock it.

Imo when some flags rly close to base then these flags should be connected by simple connections structure. So that way attackers have good chances vs defenders. When defenders can support these flags with mhqs rly fast then u need give something to attackers.

Yesterday i played this layout and i got rly bored.
First 30-40 mins we capture central flag Reach and capture enemy flag Topolia.
End was rly fast about 45 mins or less maybe we capture all 4 enemy flags.
And all other time like 2-2.5 hours we just defend Topolia cuz we cant do anything else.

I see u like simple connections at center of layouts. And more complicated closer to bases. All this make rounds last longer when attackers cant do shit. I like long rounds when there actualy some progress. But when for hours u just fuck around one flag then no ty.

And these 2 flags Plains and Remains not just hard to attack ^^ cuz all this above but they also so fkn open.
Its like u just hate attackers and do everything to make their lifes harder :)

Was fun to fight though :) But i dont want play it again.

And on reach layout truck just useless cuz so long way. U just cant be in time to reinforce attack with ur shitty truck ^^
At the same time defenders can reinforce these flags so ez.


Thanks for feedback haha :lol:

What I think I am going to do based on your feedback is edit Reach and delete the two objectives closest to each base. They are too close for the sheer size of the layout and are probably not needed. Hopefully, a simple layout with only 7 objectives will make it easier for both teams to attack and defend. This was really good data for me in the long run because I plan on making bigger distance layouts in the future and I already have made at least one "Vanguard to Frini" and another one "Tonouka Valley" in the works. If +Distance = -Objectives or maybe Closer to base = less objectives, at this point either one could potentially work in my opinion. I was really stunned when the first match of Reach lasted for around 23 hours and it was really fun to be a part of it but that was just a match made in heaven. Anyways, the problem about long distance layouts is logistics and the main part of logistics is the transportation. So my goal is probably to simplify the layout and see what data comes from this, like does it make the match shorter or longer? Does it make it more fluid? Does it make it progressive but a fun tug of war situation? Another thing is team skill, I have noticed for bigger layouts team skill is a really big changer of gameplay. The first match of Reach had equivalent team skill which could be why it lasted for so long and the second match of Reach recently had very uneven team skill and it lasted around 3 hours. A solution is as I suggested and as you suggested as well would be to simplify the map and make it easier to defend and attack points longer distances.

Also, about the flags, I recently updated the North Eastern flags as suggested by Nyles. I am not sure if it was updated during the time you played.

Anyways lol, thanks for the feedback its very helpful and will help me in future layouts as well as current ones. :bouncy:

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#20 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 6:39 pm

A simplified version that I suggested above could be this:

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What Mouse suggested could be this:

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#21 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 7:23 pm

hard to tell

i personally dont want to loose this as a long lasting layout so whichever brings that will be good lol :D
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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Hazardous Mouse
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#22 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 10:19 pm

Image
Just 7 flags. And layout regular. 7 flags so sometimes round will be just too short.
And its rly frustrating when u save up for jet or vtol and round ends before u buy them.
Too short rounds on regular layouts is evil :)


So this one 11 flags. Harder for attackers but bit longer rounds to actualy use all tanks and jets and helos.
Image

Or this one with 9 flags. Easier for attackers but maybe bit less time to use all goodies :)
Image
Q: How many liberals can figure out what 2+2= ? A: Zero, they just protest that it can be whatever it wants to be.

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aTWar
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#23 » Thu 22 Dec, 2016 10:47 pm

middle one IMO
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REVELATION 6:8 "And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth."

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RagedLemon
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#24 » Fri 23 Dec, 2016 2:54 am

UPDATED 12/22/2016

Download: https://www.dropbox.com/sh/611ph2j0nexr ... 1rO_a?dl=0

Changed layout connections in order to ease attacker progression.

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Hazardous Mouse
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Re: [new layout] Reach

Post#25 » Thu 12 Jan, 2017 4:35 pm

I rly hate this layout. I dont understand why its won polls.
So unbalanced airports.
Blu4 with very very good airport ^^ and A10 need rearm rare cuz good ammo
Greenfor with so bad airport. Worst airport on map. And greenjets needs rearm often cuz low ammo so needs more landings ^^

I just lost one jet and i gonna by one more soon. And i know what will happens when ill try land ^^

Why this crap won polls. You guys who vote for this just insane.
Best layout of this rotation Forgotten Lakatoro then 2nd best West Road Wars :) all imo.
But how this one won polls ^^ I just lose all respect to these voters.

And this layout gonna be in next rotation ^^ So we will play it again. No ty.

I understand RagedLemon ) That ppl make errors ) thats just fine. I did errors too )
We just learning. Respect to u man )

But ppl who vote for this layout ^^ just no respect for you guys.
So unbalanced layout and u vote for it. Blu4 spam vehicles air and ground vehicles. And greenfor can buy jet ^^ use so low ammo to kill couple vehs and then crash ^^ Why u vote for this crap??? Just no respect to you voters.
Q: How many liberals can figure out what 2+2= ? A: Zero, they just protest that it can be whatever it wants to be.

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